Some countries like Germany, Zimbabwe, Iraq, Iran just have a bad reputation. There are, of course, others I won’t get into (I’m looking at you North Korea). But other countries like Holland, Canada and most of Scandinavia are looked at as the good side of our small, orbiting pile of rock. Yet these nations aren’t all squeaky-clean and polite. No, some have some deep, dark, totally evil things they’ve done or are doing right now.
10. Bhutan
Bhutan is an isolated Buddhist country between China and India that forgoes measuring its progress by GDP in favor of GNH or “Gross National Happiness”. Until 1999 they didn’t even allow Internet or TV, due to their supposed corrupting influences. It’s all hippie love and Buddha
In the 1990s the Bhutanese leaders decided that the GNH didn’t apply to one of its large minority groups, the Lhotshampas. The Lhotshampas are ethnically Nepalese people who have been in Bhutan for generations, and were promptly ethnically cleansed from Bhutan territory. At the point of a gun, over a hundred thousand people were forced from their homes that they had lived in for hundreds of years into refugee camps and poverty in Nepal and India.
9. Switzerland
Think this is just a land of chocolate and weird mountain people playing on giant horns? No, the Swiss have dark secrets in their closet. During World War II, while they claimed neutrality and sat back and rode out the war, thousands of people deposited their money into it’s banks. Thousands of these account holders were killed in the carnage of the Nazi War machine. Yet when the relatives tried to claim the money, they were denied access to the funds, funds that the banks continued to make interest off. Not only did the Swiss screw over the Nazi victims but they were also the main bankers of the Nazis, funnelling hundreds of millions of dollars into the German war effort
8. Sweden
;
Now a pillar of neutrality and bikini swim teams, Sweden once had ambitions of ruling the world. Starting in the 17th century, power-hungry Sweden started expanding its territory. Excited to create a vast European Realm, the Swedish King moved his armies South in an effort to conquer Europe. They were able to defeat Russian and Polish armies during what is called “The Deluge” by Eastern Europeans. Swedes and their allies swarmed over Europe just as the Mongols did centuries earlier. They were only stopped after they tried to finish off Russia and, while invading the Motherland, were defeated by Russian Czar Peter the Great and his allies. Sweden’s dreams of Empire were over.
7. Ireland
During World War II the Republic of Ireland went above and beyond what international law dictated regarding a neutral stance. While neutral Switzerland was the Nazi Banker, and neutral America kept Britain alive by supplying tons of vital war material, Ireland decided to have absolutely nothing to do with either side. Even after the existence of Nazi death camps emerged in the closing days of World War II, Ireland refused to go against the Nazi fold.
Ireland was one of the last countries to recognize the Third Reich and, when Hitler died, Ireland offered a public condolence to the German regime. But it didn’t stop after the war; Irish men who had the moral courage to fight the Fascist Nazi regime, under various Allied flags, returned to Irish policy that officially discriminated against them. Called the “starvation order,” it was Irish government policy to prevent employment, the use of social services, and pensions to any Irishman who fought in the War. Some were even thrown in jail, while the rest lived under constant fear that they would be the next to be arrested and imprisoned.
6. Belgium
Belgium, that half-French, half-Dutch country sandwiched in between France and Holland, can’t decide whether to smoke or to surrender to that sweet, sweet bowl of home-grown. Being one of the youngest countries in Europe didn’t stop it from carving out a vast Empire in Africa, one 77 times the size of Belgium itself. Called the Congo Colony, it was run by King Léopold II who, in almost record-time, started sacrificing his citizens for the Congo’s vast resources. Eight to ten million, that’s MILLION, were killed by the Belgian Congo colonial rulers as they raped and squeezed the land in order to get more and more profit out of its jungles.
5. Bosnia
When Yugoslavia was quickly dismembering itself into smaller and smaller states, Bosnia was always the whipping boy. Picked on by the bully Serbia and its supposed friend Croatia, Bosnian citizens were quickly forced into a number of enclaves, where they were surrounded by enemy forces hoping a prolonged siege would starve them into submission.
International delegations would visit these enclaves on fact-finding missions. During a trip to one of the Sarajevo enclave, Bosnian fighters, in an effort to manipulate the opinion of the world press into supporting them, relayed to their starving people that bread would be arriving at a local bakery. Then, as hundreds lined up hoping to get food, the Bosnians, while international cameras were rolling, staged a mortar attack that killed 17 and wounded dozens more. It was later revealed that this was only one of many attacks by Bosnian fighters on civilians that were publicly blamed on Serbian forces.
4. Poland
Poland or, as it is known to the rest of the world, that place that gets the crap kicked out of it every other decade, was re-birthed in 1918 (back in 1795, it had been killed, cut up and divided like a delicious borst pie). Between 1918 and 1939, it lived in between what would become two of the greatest killing machines in the history of the world, Nazi Germany and Communist USSR. So while the rest of the world was taking bets on who would eat up Poland next, Poland was doing its best to piss off all of its smaller neighboring countries: small countries, like itself, that it could have allied with and combined forces to counter these two super powers.
In 1938, Hitler wanted Czechoslovakia. The West decided to compromise and give him a piece, called the Sudetenland, but Hitler instead took the whole damn country. Hitler was clearly on the war path, demanding living space for the German people. Poland, instead of helping and offering to protect small Czechoslovakia, stood hand-in-hand with Hitler. When Hitler started to carve Czechoslovakia up, Poland actually helped the Nazis dismember the state by invading parts of Czechoslovakia with the Nazis and claiming portions of the country for Poland. But what goes around comes around and, not a year later, the Nazi Blitzkrieg burst across the Polish border.
3. South Korea
Compared to North Korean death camps and mass slaughter of innocent civilians, South Korea always comes out smelling like roses. However, during the Korean War, it showcased its own dark side. Even before the war in 1948, on the island of Jeju, the South Korean military brutally suppressed an uprising that broke out after Korean troops fired on unarmed protesters. During the rebellion, tens of thousands were killed in organized massacres throughout the island.
Just after the island was finally brought under control, North Korean forces stormed over the border and launched the Korean War. South Korean officials, worried about 5th Column forces attacking from the rear, decided to kill hundreds of thousands of people throughout South Korea that were suspected of being sympathetic toward the advancing communists. Known as the Bodo League Massacre, it has only recently been declassified by the South Korean government.
2. Holland
During the spice rush at the dawn of the merchant era, Holland was able to corner the nutmeg market. In an effort to easily monitor and control the trade of nutmeg, Dutch officials killed all nutmeg trees on neighboring islands, and created vast nutmeg and mace plantations on the small island of Run.
In the process of setting up their very own Nutmeg Island, the Dutch were ruthless with the local population, killing any that got in their way and forcing the survivors to work under horrible conditions and handing out brutal punishments to anyone who traded Nutmeg with ships other than the Dutch. The island was so valuable that it was exchanged for the island of Manhattan, insuring that New Amsterdam would become New York.
1. Canada
Canada, a bastion of workers’ rights, quickly banned anything containing even the tiniest bit of asbestos, along with the rest of the industrial world. Yet with large asbestos mines that employed lots of people, Canada couldn’t just stop mining the cancer rocks…you know for the good of mankind. No, Canada continues to export asbestos to Third World countries, even though they know that each package is basically the Grim Reaper wrapped up in white plastic. Friendly Ol’ Canada is the only western country to export asbestos, and actually fights international regulations that would prevent it from exporting all that cancer.
When other countries try and add warnings on asbestos packaging, Canada exerts pressure to stop this even though, inside the country, a plethora of regulations not only require asbestos to be clearly marked but also basically require a space suit to handle it. Canada says that it only exports to customers that take the greatest of safety measures, yet studies show developed countries, the only ones that haven’t yet banned it, have virtually no safety regulations regarding asbestos. In short, whole generations handling asbestos will grow up with horrible forms of lung cancer.
Source
Extra! Norway
During World War II, the German Battleship Admiral Graf Spee spread mayhem in the Atlantic, sinking Allied ships before being destroyed off South America. The Spee’s support ship, the Altmark, would then pluck lucky survivors out of the ocean. The Altmark was able to slip through the British ships that cornered the Graf Spee, with 299 Allied prisoners locked away in its belly.
It made it all the way to neutral Norway in February 16, 1940. British contacts alerted the Norwegian Navy that it was hiding in Norway’s water and the British demanded that it be searched for POWs. The Navy searched the German ship three separate times and lied that they didn’t find anyone on the ship, even though it was jam-packed with Allied POWs. The British finally had enough and stormed the ship, killing several German Navy personnel but, more importantly, freeing the Allied POWs. An embarrassed Norway sulked away and pretended the whole thing never happened.
Yosomono writes for multiple sites including GaijinAss.com.
88 Comments
Belgium is anice country
what ????????????????????????????????????????????????
yes now its a nice country but if you want to look at the begium empror you will see arealy realy satan acts
I know this is old but I came accross this article in my reasearch and wanted to add a bit on it to the part about Poland, here is a bit of info from the “source”:The Czieszyn area was given to Poland in trust as result of the
Versailles Treaty. It was to be decided by plebicite who would finally
control the area. In 1920 Poland was involved in a major war with Soviet
Russia. The Czechs took the opportunity to send in their military and
occupy the area by force. Polish soldiers and police died as a result.
Additionally, the Czechs denied any rail traffic to Poland to cross
their territory. When Hitler made his move against the Czechs, Poland
took the idea that better to get their territory back than give it to
Hitler. Strange that the Czechs attitude was what it was. Both Poland
and Czechoslovakia were new countries formed as result of the Versailles
Treaty. The Czechs were hard bitten Socialists and they saw Poland as
Nationalistic and right wing despite it being the most multicultural
country in Europe. So, I guess, they were not about to have anything to
do with the Poles. Better to lose their country to the Fascists than
ally themselves with a country they have been neighbors with for a
thousand year. I would call this a mental derangement.
Everyone hates America but when they get in trouble, they call us like we are the ghostbusters. lol
Belgium didn’t own the Congo, King Leopold did.
WHERE IS TURKEY???????
I didn’t know Turkey was normally thought of as a “nice” country
(This is for number 8).
Dude, the war you’re thinking about is the great northern war and Sweden did not bloody start it!
The swedish king (Karl XII) did not try to conquer Europe. He was trying to defend Sweden.
The russians started the fucking war because Tsar Peter was fucking hungry for power.
And the deluge is not what it looks like. The swedish crown was under plenty of threats during that time
and back fucking then, the only way to claim or be recognized was to go to war.
It was over 300 years ago! Sweden have not been taking part in any war at all for 200 years.
Just commenting on the map about the colonial holdings of Belgium. There seems to be a mistake. The Philippines was under Spanish control, not Belgium.
Bosnia, South Korea and Canada aren’t “usualy nice.” Bosnia isbfounded on Islamic extremism, South Korea was a military dictatorship until the 1980s and Canada follows the US into every one of its imperialist wars.
Dude, Canada stayed out of Iraq and Vietnam, just what the hell are you talking about?
If you want to point out Canada’s flaws, then focus on the Japanese internment camps, the active discrimination and criminalization of homosexuals by the RCMP for the majority of the 20th century, the Native School fiasco in which an entire culture was almost destroyed in an attempt to civilize the “Indians”, or the existence of Stephen Harper.
As a proud Canadian myself, i had no idea about the criminaliztion of homosexuality, but i agree that we have done some horrible things in the past, however, we apologize to the world for Stephen Harper, it was our attempt to protect ourselves with an army of powerful robots.
Stephen was the prototype, but instead of creating a loyal servant, we made the most HORRIBLE, illogical, emotionless, ridiculous, evil, and most politically successful, killing machine. but i think that the world should be glad that we kept him in Canada. it was our sacrifice, for can you imagine the havoc a Harper could wreck if he became US president or British Prime Minister? the World would burn at the hands of incompetence.
Lol you’re awesome.
Poland took back territory taken by Czechoslovakia few years ago during Polish-Soviet war ,when actually Poles stopped red revolution in Europe in decisive battle near Warsaw (Miracle at the Vistula).
The name of the country is Bosnia and Herzegovina, calling it Bosnia is the same as calling the USA just “United”, and war over here was much more complicated than you explained it, so, please, do your homework or ask someone who lives there…
America killed lots of native Americans. I think that could count
A lot? It was the worst and longest genocide in history. The not only tried to kill the Native Americans, they tried to eradicate their culture.
And far worse, while Germany and other nations learned and tried to work on their past, the US still has not learned anything and is still bringing war and terror all over the world.
Why not make a list of Top 10 Evil Actions by the USA?
USA would fit better on a list of “Top 10 nice actions by usually evil countries”
The list ignored several “nice” countries:
* England
For starters, how about the complete 100 percent genocide of Tasmanians? Native Australians, Africans, Indians, Afghans and many others all have valid complaints against them. Heroin in China and Chinese addicts? Heroin DOES NOT GROW IN CHINA, the English imported it from Afghanistan and turned the Chinese into addicts, the same way the English imported alcohol to North America and cheated First Nations people out of land and furs by making them addicts.
* France
Ask the Algerians (among many others) about the genocides in their country, very similar to what Belgium did in the Congo. All the European imperialists (Spain, Italy, Portugal, Holland, et al) committed the same sorts of crimes, just in different countries.
* The USA
There isn’t a continent or region in which the US hasn’t committed war crimes.
Central and South America? The US overthrew between five and ten democracies (e.g. Chile) and helped in the mass murder of pro-democracy activists in many others (e.g. Cuba before 1959). The US also taught fascist dictators how to torture and murder (at the “School of the Americas”), supported corporations with military force to prevent unions or violate basic human rights (e.g. United Fruit, “free trade” relocation of factories, etc.).
Asia? The US opposed democracy in South Korea and the Philippines, supporting fascist dictatorship until the people of those countries fought their governments for it. The US overthrew the Iranian democracy because they wanted to control their own oil – the US is responsible for the Shah and the “islamic revolution”. Speaking of islamic fascists, it was the US which armed and trained the Mujahadeen in Afghanistan, the muscle of the Taliban and Al Qaeda. And let’s not forget the US’s decades long support of Indonesia’s fascist government. Go learn what the Straits of Malacca are if you want to know why the US wants control of southeast Asia.
The US also supported the Khmer Rouge communists in Cambodia – yes SUPPORTED THEM – by arming them with weapons, even after the Killing Fields were proven to exist. All because the Khmer Rouge wanted to overthrow the Vietnamese communist government. Funnily enough, it was the Vietnamese who overthrew the Khmer Rouge and helped Cambodia to become the democracy it is today. The US opposed the democracy.
Europe? The US openly tried to overthrow Greece’s democracy and impose a fascist dictatorship, all because the Greeks wanted to vote for a socialist government. And the CIA bugged the office of the British Prime Minister in 1968, giving secrets to the conservatives, interfering with the democracy of a sovereign nation. And let’s not forget the US forcing the USS St. Louis – carrying a 1000 jewish passengers – to return to Germany in 1939, even after it was known what Nazi Germany was doing to them.
Africa? Too many to count – Nigeria, Libya, Egypt, Sudan, Ethiopia, Angola, Rwanda, Liberia, etc. One of the biggest racist lies told is that “Africans can’t form democracies”. The reason they can’t is the US (and other imperialists) overthrow their democracies and/or US/European corporations send bribes and weapons to power hungry warlords. Why negotiate with an elected government and pay fair market prices when you can bribe a dictator and pay less for raw materials?
* Israel
If you believe the myth that Israel is a “lone outpost of freedom in a hostile land”, you’re an ignorant rube. Israel has more military power than all the surrounding “hostile” countries combined. And that’s without counting Israel’s illegally obtained 200 nuclear weapons.
Israel’s policy toward the Palestinians is one of starvation and ethnic cleansing – make life so unpleasant that people leave their homeland. Israel also takes a scorched earth policy – if a PLO or Hamas member runs crosses the land of a Palestinian farmer, the Israeli military gives the farmer an ultimatum: “Tell us where he is or we destroy your crops”. The farmer has nothing to do with it, so Israel destroys his livelihood.
Israel also gleefully employs a tactic that the Nazis were convicted of at Nuremburg: collective punishment. If a PLO or Hamas member is identified, Israel destroys the home of everyone related to him – the parents, grandparents, cousins, siblings, everybody. It doesn’t matter that none of them had anything to do with it, they destroy the homes anyway. Back to the US again, they US has borrowed that scorched earth policy in Iraq, destroying the homes and farms of Iraqis whose property is trespassed by Al Qaeda members. And it was Israel which invented the techniques of torture and humiliation of muslims the US has been using in Guantanamo, Abu Ghraib and elsewhere.
If you doubt anything I said, go look it up. It’s all verifiable.
No countries were ignored. God forbid if we had listed the United States as nice country. The Internet would have blown up. Damned if we do…
Obviously you missed – or avoided – the point.
England, France, the US and Israel are portrayed as “nice” as much as any of the ten listed.
If you disagree, just look at the propaganda of the rightwing media in the US (e.g FOX Nuisance, ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN – i.e. ALL the TV media), which pretends the US has never done any wrong and that it “cannot do any wrong”.
No country is blameless, but some like to pretend they are.
I disagree. All those media outlets (even FOX … sometimes) portray England, France, the US and Israel as anything but nice. If they were trying to jam down our throats the message that they cannot do any wrong then they wouldn’t report on their crimes, mistakes and war escapades.
What the heck channels are you watching? Of course within the United States you may find more positive news about the USA, but even with that there is more negative about us. And outside the United States, it certainly seems like most places have a cynical regard for us as war-mongering, greedy, fat, and lazy people. I think the comments on this site from foreign individuals backs that up. We are not portrayed as nice and I think if you polled people from outside our borders you would here how not nice we are thought of. Hey, I disagree, but that’s just me.
Nad who says we are blameless? No American thinks that. Every country just like every human has made mistakes. We all know that.
Do you imagine that you’ll get a good impression of how your country is viewed internationally by watching your television from home in your own country?
Those aren’t nice countries. That’s why I didn’t include them
Wouldn’t have mattered either way. Haters gonna hate. <--makes my skin crawl writing that (so stupid), but fits. Keep writing, Yosomono!
“Hater” is a word used by those with the emotional level of a five year old child.
“Troll” is used by those who speak like teenagers.
Critic is the word an adult uses.
Those countries deserve their own lists.
I am from Latvia, which is one of the territories once included into the expanding Swedish Empire.
And I want to say in defense of Swedes, that their control over the territories was a blessing, especially in comparison to what other nations did. The time of Swedish rule in Latvian folk memory (“Zviedru laiki”) is often referred to as the “Old, Good, Swedish Times”. Swedes promoted education by setting up schools for farmers’ children and limited abuse of power by the local Baltic German ruling class. Especially pitiful is the fact that when the Swedes were defeated, it was Russians, not exactly the most humanitarian and advanced Empire, who did that and took over the Baltic lands, setting back the progress and enlightenment, and bringing back the oppression of the common people.
As a Latvian, I regard the fall of the Swedish rule here as one of the dark moments in our history.
The beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Well said. Best comment here.
I believe the American Bombing of Dresden was totally unnecessary during WW II by the Americans. That city was literally a fire bomb and completely destroyed the city. Its my belief that the Allies had the Axis in the palm of their hands and that Germany was going to surrender
Destruction of Koenigsberg is what hurts me most. It was a gem of European architecture. Hometown of Imanuel Kant. A sophisticated place of high culture and rich history. It was turned into a burnt out pile of rubble, its population killed, raped, expelled and killed again. Now it is AIDS infested faceless hole, Russian bridgehead into the heart of Europe. All the rich cultural heritage gone for good.
Thank you, whoever did this (mainly the British and the Soviets)! Thanks a f*ng lot!
USA isn’t “usually nice”.
Ireland had a complicated relationship with WW2. Having emerged from a war of independence and a civil war that scarred the country hugely, with virtually no air or sea power and only a handful of troops in a European context, it’s hard to see how much of an impact Ireland could have made. Dublin was bombed by the Nazis even though we were neutral, allowing even our ports to be used would have seen widespread and indiscrimate bombing from which we couldn’t defend ourselves. Ireland joining the Allies would be akin to asking a traumatised 9 year old to pick up a gun and fight.
That said, we were “neutral towards the Allies”. We sent the British weather orts, allowed Allied craft to fly over Donegal, quietly repatriated Allied pilots shot down over Ireland but interned Axis pilots and sent fire brigades to help put out fires when Belfast was bombed.It’s claimed that may have been the reason Dublin was bombed.
Ireland’s “pro-Nazi” actions included our President giving his condolences to the German ambassador on Hitler’s death (stage-managed if unfortunate public demonstration of neutrality) and, eh, that’s it. The IRA liked the Nazis (obviously) and tried to cosy up to them by helping them form an Irish brigade within the German army, which was aborted due to lack of interest.
But plenty of Irishmen fought for the Allies, many in the same British Army they had fought not 20 years previously. And while what happened to returning soldiers was terrible, they had abandoned their national army, which was carrying out the neutral policy of the elected Irish government. Not many nations back then would have said nothing to such people, who would be referred to as deserters.
This is a crucial point. The men who were discriminated against were those that deserted the Irish Army to sign up to a foreign army in a time of war. Most other countries would have shot them for desertion.
very poor research on this one. they should have put down Call of duty and read a history book
Yeah like the American’s who were totally shot for treason for joining the Allies while the US was neutral. Yeah they were totally persecuted by their government … please.
He said most, not like America.
What absolute rubbish trying to justify the Irish government policy of ignoring those returning soldiers, sheer hypocrisy when still excepting British aid.
WHAT!!!! NO USA AND GREAT BRITAIN
oh come on great britain were one of the most blood thirsty countries.they killed millions of people in india ALONE
i guess i need not say about USA
Did you read the other comments, the USA is not usually nice, at least according to most comments.
Well, the massacre at Wounded Knee wasn’t a very nice thing to do, nor was the My Lai massacre or the No Gun Ri massacre, for starters.
Yeah, no, they really don’t deserve a spot in the “nice country list”. But, meh, as this ranking shows that list would be awfully short anyway.
India was a dump before we were there.. And it`s an even bigger dump now..
“INDIA WAS A DUMP”
HaHaHA u must be joking.read history doofus india was one of the richest countries in the world then the parasite british came sucked us dry destroy everything we had and built their nation on blood of many.the brits were thieves don’t deny it thats pathetic
As to us being a dump it took us only 60 yes after being independent to become a nuclear power and a emerging superpower(read newspapers or at least see wh ur country is begging to be ally with).
it was supposedly a ‘jewel’ in your crown. A jewel you chopped up, shat on and flushed down the toilet. You want to see a dump? walk around any british city
At least we have a sewer system
India was richest countries in the world before england looted . Almost 1/4th of the world’s wealth was in India and then came the british and robbed us. Guys just think how it would be to fight to live in your own home. The only system thats working for you guys right now is sewer system.
1/4 of the world’s riches in what exactly? Resoucres? Gold? Stock?
What utter rubbish; individual fiefdoms fighting each other treating their people like the dirt they walked on at least the British brought India together as one nation under an adminstration that worked and a law that is the mirror image of the Old Bailey. The marvellous Indian soldier who responded to the colours during two world wars has our utmost respect but it was under the British Army system that he fought.
One of the more unfair articles that I have seen. Yes, some of these seem horrible (looking at you Bhutan, South Korea, Ireland, Belgium, Holland, Canada, and for the most part Switzerland). But cut a little slack for the conditions of the time.
Yes, Sweden did horrible things during its imperial expansion, but it is no worse than what all the other countries of Europe were doing at the time. Not a good excuse, I know, but give them a little leeway.
With Switzerland, that is cruel what they did to the victims’ families, but forgive them for being the Nazi’s bankers. Yes, Switzerland had a good army and is in the most defensible location in the world, but they were surrounded by axis powers (Nazi Germany to the north and east, Italy to the south, Vichy France to the west). They had to give in to axis pressure in order to keep their neutrality (which they did very well for a country completely surrounded by one side) and their sovereignty. And they were still the center of the Red Cross, probably the best organization of the war, and maintained good neutrality.
For Norway, they had the Germans knocking on their door in February 1940, so they weren’t exactly neutral. It was not the smartest move, for it cost them any chance of British help, but they were probably trying to placate the Germans into not invading (which they would do anyway in a couple months).
Basically, what I am saying, is that while all of these actions are very reprehensible, it is not completely black and white. Some of them were desperate for help, others were desperate not to be conquered, and others were just doing what everyone else was doing. I thank this article for highlighting all the awful things these countries have done, but some of them had understandable reasons for doing it.
I think Sweden was chosen because the Swedish Empire isn’t as well known as, say, the British or French Empire.
They get away with it cause not one cares about Canada.
Canada ? Here is my ‘get rich’ solution for you regarding Canada. Find as many Canadian Pennies as you can and put them in a safe place. Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe that the Canadian Penny has been stopped being made. How do I know and have heard this fact ? My Paternal Grandparents were both from Quebec City, My Uncle lives in Montreal and my father (though born in America in Cambridge Mass.) Went to a college called St. Anne de la Poctiere, 100 miles north of Quebec City As a child I vivdly remember the Canadian Penny. Now its my understanding that it is no longer made. Also, try to collect as many Baseball Cards Of The Montreal Expos, since they are no longer a team, That might make some money. Personally, I Love Canada !!
We aren’t going to talk about Canada?
you know it really annoys me, the way people bang on and on about Nazi Germany. Their`s been FAR, FAR, worse genocides than the Holocaust. A lot of people probably don`t know, that JEWS have been some of the biggest mass-murderers in history. We hear violin music everyday about 6, million Jews, but how many people know about how it was a Jew, Lazar Kaganovich, of the USSR, who was responsible for the Holodomor, the famine in the Ukraine, where 10, million starved to death, and was also responsible for blowing up the beautiful Christ the Saviour Church? It was also Jews that ran the dreaded SMERSH, and NKVD, which killed millions. And what about Mao? 70, MILLION are thought to have died. Why don`t we hear or see films about these war-crimes?
I have seen documentaries about some of the genocides and events you mentioned on PBS, The History Channel, and possibly even the Military Channel. I have also seen discussions about these events, and the movies and books that are about them, on several websites. They do not get mentioned much, you are right about that, and they should be more well known, but that does not mean the Jewish victims of the Holocaust shouldn’t be mourned or the acts and events that led to them being in that situation should be ignored. If anything it’s a way to introduce people to these other horrible events that you listed. I understand what you are saying, and I agree with you on some of your points, but I don’t agree with your tone.
Simple: Because the Holocaust was one of the rare occaisions of organized killing of special groups of people (not just Jews, everyone forgets the other victims – so the numbers are far higher, scratching 10 million or more plus the civilians the SS killed in the fields). No matter how many Stalin or Mao killed – they never had the same death factories as Hitler did. Mass executions, starvation and forced labour to death happen in every dictatorship – but they aren’t organzied from the highest top in their full extent.
The closest thing to the Holocaust in my opinion is the Red Khmer regieme. Their death toll is much lower, but the country was much smaller too.
Still, the Holocaust is uniqe. There hasn’t been any other time where death was industrialized like that. Records where kept and victim quotas had to be met by the authorities.
Worse killings happend – but only by numbers. And with this numbers you always have to consider how many people there where at all.
Thank you for your explanation. I wanted to make some of the same points you did, but I could not for the life of me write them in a way that would make sense.
“No matter how many Stalin or Mao killed – they never had the same death factories as Hitler did”
Stalin’s USSR did not have “death factories” simply because they did not need them.
Soviets simply packed up everybody into the kettle railroad cars and brought them to Siberian GULAG death camps, where the cold and starvation finished the victims off effectively enough with no further intervention. GULAG survivors recall piles of frozen dead bodies stacked up like firewood logs. And soil so full of sculls and bones, that one couldn’t dig a hole in the ground without hitting human remains.
“No matter how many” – I find it hard to agree with you. It DOES matter “how many”. … Especially since the Commies killed more innocent people than Nazis ever intended to.
“Stalin’s USSR did not have “death factories” simply because they did not need them.”
I case you don’t know: The Nazis had death through labour camps too. Flossenbürg for example. They didn’t need gas chambers there, too. But the Nazis still had them in some other camps that were not for labour but just for plain extermination. Stalin didn’t have those.
“Especially since the Commies killed more innocent people than Nazis ever intended to.”
The Commies had a little more time, don’t you think? Hitler couldn’t do that much in those few years he had. If Hitler had the time and power Stalin did (and also the population, mind you!) it would be different.
The “intended to” is very cynical. How do you count that? You can’t take the estimates for the Wannsee conference, because they only counted Jews, not Sinti and Roma, communists, Jehova’s Witnesses, handicapped people and homosexuals.
Seems you are missing the point. If Nazis would had access to wast uninhabited territories like Soviets did, they might have chosen to use the Soviet method of bringing the people to wilderness to die from cold and hunger, or violence of the guards, instead of bothering to build what not in the little and crowded Europe. On other hand, possibly Soviets would have chosen to use the sophisticated Nazi system of logistics and mass extermination, if they would had German punctuality, high tech level and discipline, which they did not have. Neither they had problems with lack of space to hide what they were doing. So “Jedem das Seine” – each did the killing in their own specific ways, fitting their situations, abilities and cultural traditions. Do not forget, that Nazi “specialists” visited Soviet Union in nineteen-thirties, and SS and Gestapo officers learned how to establish and run the prison/death camp system from the example of Soviet GULAG, and later adapted it to European conditions. Talk about “intellectual property” here…
Also, what really counts is that the Commies actually *did kill more* people than the Nazis. That is *a fact*, the rest is speculations. And as of speculations – had Nazis killed more than Commies if nobody had interfered? I doubt it. Why? Because of the mode of internal operation of the regimes. Nazis had specific groups of people they were targeting. They did it with cold and evil logic. Commies, on other hand, were targeting pretty much everybody, each and every strata and group of society. Besides they did it in constantly shifting, paranoid and irrational way. Even the closest people to Stalin or their family members got imprisoned, tortured and executed, to be replaced by others, who experienced similar fate soon enough. So there is a reason to assume that Nazi genocide would go down to some minimal levels after they had dealt with the groups they saw unfit for the New Europe, while the terror in the Commie world would go on and on perpetually. Which it did. Terror basically relaxed after death of Stalin. Western stance in the Cold War did not let the Commies took over all of the Europe and saved millions of people who otherwise would have suffered horribly.
And, do you know that Soviets, just like Nazis, also sent to prison camps homosexuals and made handicapped people to disappear (especially notorious is the removal of handicapped war veterans – so that they would not spoil the bright Socialist paradise with their looks. No, they did not outright kill them, they just collected them and put in some kind of colonies).
And, do you know that, after occupation of the countries of Europe after 1939, Soviets used to kill or send to the camps people for knowing how to speak English or just for being a stamp collector (because that meant having or being able to have international contacts, which was not tolerated by the Commies)?
On the one hand, about the killing methods, you are speculating that the Nazis would have used the Soviet method if they had the means and the other way around, on the other hand, you are accusing me of speculation about the possible numbers of deaths.
If I’d say both are invalid, you are still giving the best argument yourself: The cold nazi logic. The genocide was basicly written into the foundations of nazi ideology – for communism, it was Stalin’s pervertation of an abstract, unreal idea.
What I don’t understand is how you come to think that the genocide would have gone down at a point, if the nazis could have erased all groups they saw unfit. The nazis murdered people opposing their ideas, just like Stalin did, too.
Furthermore, you say correctly, that the terror in the USSR partly stopped after Stalin’s death – how can you say it “would” have gone on perpetualy? Stalin mainly murdered out of his own paranoid ideas and terrorized those around him that much, that his ideals did not survive him – even though the political system of oppression and the possibilities to keep the killing up remained.
Hitler on the other hand, kept is paladins very much safe, only at the beginning he got rid of some. If it wouldn’t have been endend by force, the killing would have gone on for some generations.
I don’t count your statements, what special groups of people the Soviets deportet and killed as an argument – because you can make the same statement about the Nazis too. Listening to the wrong radio station meant death penalty for “Wehrkraftzersetzung”, to give just one example. That the Nazis got their idea of camps from the Gulags might be true, but it doesn’t change anything. Hitler got the idea to become the Führer from Mussolini and still did much “better” than him.
My opinion remains: The Stalin regime killed more people, but this is because it lasted longer and had control over a bigger population. There was no strict ideology of mass murder, so only a fraction did survive Stalins death. The Nazis on the other hand, also practiced mass murder of alleged enemies, but in addition they had an agenda for genocide hard-wired into their ideology.
I would have felt safer in post-Stalin USSR than in a post-Hitler Nazi Germany.
But after all, maybe we should settle on the fact that it’s incredibly stupid to argue about things like that.
Bully Serbia? Are you peope mad??
I know right. Bully? Serbia is not a bully, it’s a psychopathic killer.
So where is Germany and the 6,000,000 Jewish people that Nazi Germany massacred during WWII but today is regarded as a nice country to visit. Lets put it into simplistic terms about the number of 6,000,000 people who died horribly at the hands of Hitler and his henchmen. That means that the total casualties of death during (regardless of soldier or civilian) WWII, is 11% of the people who perished between 1939 – 1945 because of it.
Germany isn’t on the list because, as the author stated, it isn’t really seen as a country that is usually nice, specifically for the reasons you just pointed out.
It may be gaining a reputation as a nicer country, but the attemepted genocide of the Jewish people and ALL of the victims of the Holocaust who don’t usually get mentioned – Roma people, disabled people, Polish and Soviet citizens, and other people of different religious and political groups which, when added together, are estimated to be 11 to 17 million victims – have not been forgetten and is still seen as one of the most abhorrent acts in history.
Becaus of this dark, horrible period in German history that is so very recent and still fresh in people’s minds, Germany doesn’t have the repuation as a “usually nice country”. It is making strides towards being seen in a better light, but it’s not nearly out of the shadow of the Holocaust yet.
@ Trek Girl. Thank You for your reply and it never occurred to me about Blacks, Homosexuals, Handicapped people, etc., just that 6,000,000 Jewish People died in the course of WWII. When I was a child in Elementary School, there was a library and the librarian, who spoke English with a Polish accent, had a tattoo of a 6 digit number, (I believe it was 6, maybe more) on her left arm. I never asked her as to what it meant, so I went to my father who knew her and my Dad sat me down and told me that she was a survivor of Auschwitz and that the Nazis would put that number on for identification. She died just recently (she was from New Hampshire, where I am from originally) and the Newspaper for the city (Concord) devoted the whole front section to her life. She was a very cordial and nice lady to chat with plus her son and I were close friends. I am sure that you have probably seen “Triumph Of The Will” directed by Leni Riefenstahl, but another Riefenstahl documentary was the one about the 1936 Summer Olympic Games where the great Jesse Owens (a Black Man) won 4 Gold Medals in Track & Field. You should see it for how miserably ticked off Hitler was as he was a spectator, that a Black Man just rubbed his Aryan ideology into his face. I highly recommend it.
I have never watched all of “Triumph of the Will”, but I think I might have seen a few scenes from it.
I heard about the Jesse Owens situation at the olympics, but the program that introduced this event to me didn’t go in-depth – at least not that I can remember. Knowing that Hitler and his followers were shown what’s what in that manner is significant, and it is especially significant to me because I am Jewish and of African descent.
The librarian sounds like a wonderful woman. I am glad that she was given a proper farewell by having the most prominent section of the newspaper devoted to her. That is a heartwarming story.
See, it`s not just North Korea who`s the bad guy! Lets give Nutty North Korea a break. does anyone take that crazy place seriously anyway?
surprise surprise, no mention of the USA
That is because it says usually nice
Yes, we are usually the evil empire bent on world destruction of world domination, we don’t care which!
even though its dripping with sarcasm, that is the general opinion of the entire world.
I’m sure we deserve all the bad press. I mean, really, what have we ever done to help any country.
How about invading countries, bombing countries, imposing emargoes, propping up despots, destablishing elected governments?
If the author had included the United States, commenters would have said the USA is not USUALLY nice and shouldn’t be listed. Since the United States wasn’t all the list, of course, it is assumed we are stating the USA has never done anything wrong and should be on the list. We can’t win.
Ireland had to remain neutral in WW2. Only 20 years before Ireland fought the British to gain independence so people did not want to ally with the British. Ireland actually helped the Allies in many ways.
there’s neutrality and then there’s passive aggressive support
Ireland was supportive to the Allies
Yep, so much so that things like food from the US that helped keep it alive during the war were shipped across the Atlantic through the U-Boat wolfpacks with no, zero, nada Irish support. Allied sailors died to keep Ireland alive and the Irish did damn all to help them.
we could’nt afford to help them, it was not our war to fight. if we want to stay neutral that’s our choice. plus by that time we just gained our independence from the brits. after all that bad blood. you can expect us not to stop everything at the drop of a hat to help them.
Ireland helped plenty. It allowed use of its airspace by allied forces, it returned allied airmen accross teh border while imprisoning german forces. all the while being threatened with invasion by Churchill. What sort of support would you expect? Ireland had no weapons, no tanks, no airforce to fight a war.
Actually Northern Ireland helped in the great war while IRA men were actively buying weapons from the Nazi’s in the hope that they would annihilate Britain and leave little Ireland alone and independent. {Even though the Germans had already had written plans to invade Ireland after they dealt with the British and exterminate their 4,000 jews who lived there at the time. Not only were the Irish funding the Nazi war machine by buying out of date gubs so the Nazis could upgrade, they were also contracted by the Nazis to bomb British parliamentary buildings, forts, training camps, docks etc. {anything to stunt their attack on the Germans and to weaken the British defences from within} However, the IRA couldn’t even accomplish this because instead of bombing the camps etc. they preferred to bomb and kill innocent people in pubs/bars parks etc. in England and even Northern Ireland. {like they have done for years and continue to do today} and to show how messed up they are with their acts of killing innocents to justify their apparent ‘struggle’ the Nazis were even appalled by their actions {hypocritical} and called off their arrangement. The Nazis were using the Irish from the start and they were too stupid and caught up in their proxy war of sabotage, executions and murders that they failed to realise this. Ironically, today nationalists {mainly catholic} Irish people call us unionists{mainly protestant} Irish people Nazis. lol. Yeah and it was my ancestors who fought against the Nazi regime, not yours. This is something most Americans and other allied countries are unaware of because they seem to think that the Brits are the bad guys here, wrong. I have only been terrorised by one type of people here, Irish {both nationalist and unionist alike}. The IRA have killed almost twice the amount of unionist paramilataries and British Secret Services put together. The IRA is over 2000 deaths in the province since 1968 and the British Secret Services only 380 {and considering the majority were armed terrorists killed by the Brits and the majority innocent civilians by the IRA} Just ask any American war vet who was stationed in Northern Ireland about how they were ill treated by people down south and how only the North and very few southerners helped the allies. They were happy to let the Nazi roll in blowing heads, naively believing they would preserve little Ireland, yeah right, they were masters of annexation, inexorable conquerors. In conclusion, they tried to put the knife into the allies and destroy their war effort and failed. They tried to sabotage the allies when they were faced by a much more serious and impending threat, cowards hiding their facing with balaclavas! I wish America would open it’s eyes! Also, the vast majority of people in Northern Ireland are happy with British Rule and sure as hell wouldn’t want murdering, terrorist scum like Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinness to take the reigns, don’t people realise that the first act of power would be to expel all protestants from ‘their’ land, even though I was born and raised in Ireland for the last 22 years and my family goes back hundreds of years, so how exactly does a 17 year old proxy soldier with a pipe bomb and a balaclava have more right than me to live in these lands? Terrorism needs to stop, that is just the long and short of it.
P.S. when I refer to unionists and nationialist commiting acts of murder, kidnapping, bombing, maiming etc. I refer to the paramilatary sides of those. I understand wholeheartedly that there are good people North and South and England and I certainly have friends of protestant and catholic upbringings. I myself am raised as a protestant {however I am an atheist}. I respect people with Faith in God but religion is more often than not becoming used as a tool for bad people to commit heinous acts against fellow human beings and either get away with it completely, or quite delusionally be regarded as a martyr or hero, or be put in prison for a ridiculously low prison sentence only to be released as a ‘political’ prisoner; only to continue their spree of crime, violence, bigotry and sectareanism.
STOP TERRORISM!
THANKS, ARTY
You are clueless please do the world a favour and sever your internet connection immediately. People like you are the reason there is bigotry and hatred division through societies.
” Poland, instead of helping and offering to protect small Czechoslovakia, stood hand-in-hand with Hitler. When Hitler started to carve Czechoslovakia up, Poland actually helped the Nazis dismember the state by invading parts of Czechoslovakia with the Nazis and claiming portions of the country for Poland.”
Actually Poland took back Zaolzie which was taken from them in 1919. On the 23rd of January 1919 Czechoslovakia entered Cieszyn with their troops and took it and from then there were fights between the 2 countries about the boarders
Ireland was in bed with the Catholic Church as was Germany. That unholy union was greater than any political union with the west. Religion is a big factor in any war, often determining who fights where.. The Catholic Church is up to its neck in blood from WWII as are all the other major religions of the world
Really interesting and thoughtful list. Notable mention would be Sri Lanka who did grave injustice to the Tamil people recently.
Hmm… interesting article ( im from Denmark so sry for my bad english) but i couldn stop thinking about how ridiculeous this top 10 is. You could mention nearly every country in the world in this list including US. From having the 13 colonies to expanding all the way to the west in Califonia ect. and whiping out nearly all of the indians and letting the rest having small reserves, giving by the Americans. im just saying.
Yeah, but it’s called “usually nice countries”. USA is not one of those.
Interesting comment since the USA is always the first country everyone comes to for a hand out and it’s also always the first to provide it…